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Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Knights Of the Southerncross
   |
Posted - 2007.10.25 06:29:00 -
[1]
Actually the other empire faction ships (minus the Fleet Pest) also get a hidden damage bonus by the additional lowslot they get. They are armortankers, and so the extra low usually means an extra damage mod that can be fitted. CNR is a shieldtanker with 5 lows, so adding another really would not do much for damage (3 damage mods are standard fit), hence the only way to boost damage is adding a launcher.
The same thing should have been done for the Fleet Tempest too, remove a low and add a turret and it is a fine ship.
Please don't try seeing imbalances where there are none.
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.26 06:15:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 26/10/2007 06:24:02
 Originally by: Aramendel
Originally by: Akita T
LAR+plate or 2xLAR, 3 resist mods = 5 slots. So yeah, you usually fit just 2 damage mods, but 3 on the faction.
Uh.. why on earth would you fit a plate on a PvE setup? That is high stupidity. And you can tank most missions with a single LAR.
Standard fit for LAR mission tanks I used are LAR, 3-4 hards, 0-1 CPRs. This leaves room for 2 damage mods. Navy ships allow a 3rd. Only exception are missions against EM-heavy enemies, which you can tank with just two hards and thus always fit 3 HS. One reason why the Navy Poc really has nothing on the Abaddon.
As for the Marauders, the Kronos should work nicely against Serps, Angels, Mercs and their derivates, and maybe even against Guristas. It should become one of the top dogs for missions in its current state.
The others are disappointing though, mostly because they all have one issue that makes them impractical for missioning. (Web bonus on Pally and Exp velo on Golly are worthless for PvE, and the Vargurs PG forces it to use ACs which even with Falloff bonus are still impractical for PvE against most NPCs.)
This could be easily fixed by changing those bonuses to something useful (mainly damage) and boosting the Vargur PG to make it use arties, but whether that will happen...
Guess CCP just loves Gallente too much.
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 06:49:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 27/10/2007 06:50:56
Originally by: Akita T
How they SHOULD be :
Kronos Bonuses: unchanged
Vargur Bonuses : unchanged
But increase the grid a bit so it can fit arties instead of ACs.
Golem Bonuses (alongside MORE PG so it can fit siege launchers AND tank):
10% bonus to BS class missile velocity per Caldari BS level
10% bonus to BS class missile flight time per Caldari BS level
7.5% bonus to shield boost amount per Marauder level
5% bonus to BS class missile kinetic damage per Marauder level (pathethic) or -5% bonus to BS class launcher rate of fire per Marauder level (identical to Raven)
Paladin Bonuses (alongside at least +25% base MAXCAP compared to Kronos, so roughly around +20% compared to Vargur/Golem):
5% bonus to large energy turret damage per Amarr BS level
10% bonus to large energy turret optimal per Amarr BS level (alternatively, a +10% web range bonus)
7.5% bonus to armor repair amount per Marauder level
7.5% bonus to large energy turret tracking per Marauder level
Almost spot on, I would just do the racially correct tanking bonuses and give Golem and Paladin resists rather than boost amount bonus. (Since you proposed that yourself just two posts higher, I am surprised you did not include it anyway  )
And the Golem must get a damage bonus to ALL damage types, or a RoF bonus, to be a truly great mission ship. Or, since the Kronos will be the king of kinetic anyway and we do not need two, violate the racially correct bonuses here (I wonder if this is why they were nicknamed Violators?) and give it a thermal missile damage bonus. So we have one Marauder for each damage type.
Also while I would love the optimal bonus on the Pally, it would probabaly make it too powerful. For PvE purposes, a cap recharge time bonus like on the new Sac would be a more balanced variant imho. Web range works too though.
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 10:27:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 27/10/2007 10:29:03
And who exactly is going to 0.0 PvE in a 500+ mil ship that does it only marginally better than a T1 ship (or actually worse in case of the Paladin)?
Really, 0.0 ratting is the last thing that needs a T2 BS to do it. Heck I would bet that my pimped Sac can do it faster against Angels than any of the Marauders except the Kronos. And plexes can be easily done with cheap T1 stuff as well.
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 11:01:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 27/10/2007 11:01:32
Originally by: Akita T
They look almost exactly like what a NEWBIE missionrunner would like to have. You know, a barely-skilled one ?
You know, that is too damn true. Newbies overtank their ships. They don't know which variables help them most when tweaked. They fit webs to combat scramblers. Newbies like the inefficient versatile approach. They prefer finishing safely over finishing fast. They like to loot and fight in the same ship. They don't know jack about effective dps. They don't change fittings according to missions. Hell, even I was like that when I was a n00b.
And all this is stuff these ships cater to. So basically we have ships designed for a n00b approach to missions which require the skillset of a dread pilot. Definitely in line with CCPs faible for inconsistencies.
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 12:38:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 27/10/2007 12:38:10
Role bonus: +100% Laser damage
Caldari BS: +5% Laser damage
Amarr BS: +7.5% Laser tracking
Which actually makes it better than the current Paladin despite having only half as many bonuses and no resist boost...
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.27 12:43:00 -
[7]
Yep.
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.28 06:05:00 -
[8]
Well, considering that there is only minor tweaking required for critical improvements on the three subpar Marauders which would bring them up to Kronos levels, I have not yet lost hope that CCP might see reason. They have done some surprising buffs for missioners in the past few months (like increasing gate jump radius), so I was beginning to hope they had lost some of their gankbearish anti-missioner bias recently. But then the Marauders' bonuses hit Sisi...
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.30 16:04:00 -
[9]
Originally by: J Valkor
Originally by: Akita T
Or that 
If you spend a shedload of ISK for something, you expect it to be better at what you want it to be.
Or else, you know, you don't buy it.
With a proper build, yes. I cannot loot or salvage while running a mission in a CNR, or even a Raven. I know players like to jack off over run times, but loot brings a lot of extra money to the table. Shooting faction torps (only half the ammo requirements and torps need to be hit by 2 defenders to take down) to 50k with a single TP, AB, five slot tank, and rigs devoted to missile range.
****, I sort of want one now.
Tbh you won't be able to loot or salvage L4s in a Marauder either. 1 Tractor and 2 Salvagers without tackles is crap to begin with, you probably wont have the cap to spare while in the thick of combat either, not to mention that when you concentrate on fighting you wont be able to concentrate on looting very much. (Unless you have an AFK fighting fit, but I hope CCP didn't design these ships for the AFK crowd...) Personally I will leave wrecks still turned off on the overview and come back in my salvage cane even when flying a Marauder. The only thing I might do is fit 3 tractors to gather the BS wrecks all in one place. But then again I might need NOS in highs since I can fit only 2 CCCs rather than 3 (or 0 rather than 1 in case of the Golem, my CNR has 2 missile velo rigs and so would my Golem).
The loot/salvage while fighting is really only useful for 0.0 PvE (ratting and plexes), not so much for L4 missions.
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.10.31 13:23:00 -
[10]
The thing is that at least for me the real money is in the salvage, the loot is just a small extra. And the Marauders WILL suck at salvaging compared to a rigged salvagecane. The only useful application for tractor beams on Marauders are missions against EoM, rogue drones and mercs, and maybe structures that drop good loot. Most missions are against pirates that have **** for loot though, but some of them offer decent salvage. And there a lootboat is still better even after the Marauders. For example in Amarr missions, you will do better in Abaddon and Hurricane than in the current Paladin. And this is why all the Marauders should do the same or more DPS than the best damage T1 battleship.
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves
Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 10:27:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Carniflex
Not really. They propably intended it that way and are quite content with current stats on them. They are good pvp boats and very good tanks. Damage wise well ... not so stellar but I have feeling they really did not want to make missionrunning any faster than it's already is.
Then please explain to me the brilliance of the Kronos compared to the suckiness of the other three...
There is no 'n' in turret
There is no 'r' in faction
There is no 'a' in Scorpion
There is no 'e' in Caldari
There is no makeup in rogue drones |
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